Joseph Robert Hartman
Joseph Robert’s records give us the Hartman side of this discovery: Robert Hartman and Eliz. Couts as parents, Etta Chambers as his wife, and children whose own records preserve her maiden surname. Whether his family also connects to Ida Jane’s mother Mary is still being researched.
His death certificate records February 3, 1860.
Documented certificate entryThe death year is 1923. Sandy’s summary gives October 9; the available certificate appears to give October 18, repeated in the medical entries. Both readings remain documented pending reconciliation.
Conflicting transcription · inspect originalThe certificate names Robert Hartman and Eliz. Couts. Couts is retained as recorded; spelling variants may be used in searches. This does not independently identify Mary J. Hartman Toland as his sister.
Documented certificate entriesThe certificate records widowed status, deceased wife Etta Eliz. Chambers, and informant Henry Hartman of Ravenna, Ohio.
Documented certificate entriesThe records behind the connection
The Washington County, Pennsylvania application names father Joseph Robert Hartman; mother Etta Hartman; and mother’s maiden name Etta Chambers. It records Ida’s birthplace as Bloomfield, Indiana, and residence as Ravenna, Ohio.
Documented application entriesThis independently records Etta’s maiden surname. Ida Hartman is distinct from Ida Jane Toland Chambers. Elizabeth Etta’s proposed parentage remains a separate memorial-attributed identification.
The son’s 1937 death certificate
The certificate records birth January 27, 1905, and death in January 1937 in Cleveland, Ohio. It names Joseph Hartman and Etta Chambers as parents. It records a gunshot injury, classifies the death as homicide, and attributes the shooting to his estranged wife. No motive or circumstances beyond the certificate are inferred.
The original death certificates document the names they report. The grave photograph documents its inscription. Find a Grave’s contributed parent links are a separate source claim; matching Etta Chambers to Elizabeth Etta, daughter of Silas and Matilda, remains a supported identification needing direct corroboration.
One family, two possible connections
Working hypothesis—not established: the 1870 West Bethlehem Township household includes Mary Hartman, 18, and Joseph, 10, with Robert and Elizabeth Hartman. Joseph Robert’s death certificate names Robert Hartman and Eliz. Couts. Ida Jane Toland’s marriage register names her mother Mary J. Hartman. If that Mary is the census Mary, Joseph Mart married Mary’s daughter Ida while his proposed sister Elizabeth Etta married Mary’s brother Joseph Robert. Mary’s identity and Elizabeth Etta’s parentage still require independent corroboration. No confirmed double-family link is drawn in the tree.
Well-supported research hypothesis · not confirmedMeet Elizabeth Etta Chambers Hartman · Meet Joseph Robert Hartman
Their son: following the original name
The 1937 certificate names Joseph Hartman and Etta Chambers as parents. Meet their son → His certificate appears to name John Riley; Sandy’s research identification Joseph Albert remains flagged for reconciliation. The separate case story is linked from his profile.